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1964 Classic 660 voltage reg.

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westree View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote westree Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 1964 Classic 660 voltage reg.
    Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 10:37am
Hi all,

I have been searching through these posts to find a regulator that looks like the one in my 64. It has 3 posts on the right side and 1 on the left. It also has a resistor that sits on top of it that connects to the top post on the right side(I'll try to post a picture). Left side is a red power wire. Right side from top to bottom goes: 2 orange, green, white. One additional wire connects to the top of the regulator to a screw port.
I am getting inconsistant power. Battery functioning and all posts and connections have been snaded and cleaned. I am trying to find the problem.

Any ideas?

Wes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocklandrambler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 5:31pm
By any chance are you located in Canada?  I have a voltage regulator out of a '64 Classic 660 and it looks NOTHING like the one you described.  I believe Canadian cars used different alternators and regulators.  
Past AMC's
1974 Hornet X (new)
1975 Gremlin X (new)
1964 Classic 660 Cross Country
1965 American 440-H
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vinny View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vinny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 7:25pm
I once searched through hundreds of pages of a Napa catalogue and found one that may or may not be correct and the price was close to $200. Other than that I think they are obsolete. You will need to find a used one from a Canadian car or convert to a newer style like a CS130 Gm type.

Wiring is easy if you want to go that route. Hooking up to the 196 style mount will take a bit of work. PM me if you want and I'd be happy to help.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 8:32pm
Sounds like a generator, not an alternator, regulator to me. That is if the red wire is powered with key off.

Otherwise, some EARLY alternators had a red instead of orange wire to the regulator, but that was hot only with key on.

In any case, we can figure out what you have and either find the correct regulator, or if an early alternator, can get you a regulator made for that era that was put out by AMC to replace the early alternator regulators. 

Are the regulator connections by SCREW or does it PLUG IN?
That will tell me if it's alternator or generator, but I can also pull out my 64 books and find more info, too.

No need to go to the work of a conversion on that car with extremely MODEST requirements, I may even have the correct brackets to stick an alternator on it, and a good used period regulator. 
I have wiring diagrams going back into the late 50s for some cars, early 60s for AMC and most information on the charging systems used over the years on AMC.

I am JUST BACK tonight from Alaska so my internal clock is all askew, and I'm not yet unpacked an back up to snuff (didn't help got "acute respiratory infection" during the last tow days......... bummer)


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vinny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 8:36pm
Alternator output goes up the orange wire across the regulator to the red wire and follows in the harness to the firewall where it splits. One end goes inside the car and the other to the starter. From the starter the charging current goes to the battery so quite a distance travelled to get it there. The small orange wire spliced to the big orange wire goes to the indicator lamp. White and green would not be used if going to a new style alternator with a built in regulator. Black is ground as I remember it.

At 145000 miles one of my alternator bearings was shot and the brushes had worn down to the wires.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote westree Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 8:43pm
I am in Canada. Ya, I guess it's time to switch it over. 

Thanks for the info.

Wes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote westree Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 8:53pm
Sorry to hear that Bill. Thanks for the info. 
I'll see if the red wire is powered with the key off. I was thinking that it could be a gen at first, but I am not too familiar with how they looked. It really looks like an alternator. I can't seem to figure out how to post a picture on here, or I would take a few snaps. 

Thanks Vince.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 9:55pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/21/2018 at 10:12pm
Originally posted by vinny vinny wrote:

Alternator output goes up the orange wire across the regulator to the red wire and follows in the harness to the firewall where it splits. One end goes inside the car and the other to the starter. From the starter the charging current goes to the battery so quite a distance travelled to get it there. The small orange wire spliced to the big orange wire goes to the indicator lamp. White and green would not be used if going to a new style alternator with a built in regulator. Black is ground as I remember it.

At 145000 miles one of my alternator bearings was shot and the brushes had worn down to the wires.


Sorry, no, OUTPUT does NOT go via orange. That is the reg connection.

only the Rambler classic GENERATOR has battery red to the regulator.

In 63 and perhaps 64 the wire in the regulator PIGTAIL that is later orange, was red then. HOWEVER, the harness wire that goes to the regulator is orange even if the regulator pigtail wire is red.

63 and 64 had THREE wires to the regulator, not 4 like later. They also used a resistor that often looked just exactly like an ignition ballast resistor. that was a 75 ohm resistor and was external in those years.
But the output never went out an orange wire - only the reg connection.
Output was always on a heavier red wire that went to the starter solenoid to get to the battery. 
With the later years and FORD type starter and fender mounted solenoid, the red wire went up there.
with the earlier GM type starter and solenoid mounted on the starter, the battery connection went there as did the RED output from the alternator. The path was not all that much different - because the alternator was generally on the same side as the starter and battery - the output either went up to the fender mounted solenoid or back to the starter mounted GM type solenoid.
The orange always served the same purpose - run the ALT dash light and to excite the field.

1963 and 64 Rambler Classic came with generator OR alternator and the diagrams show both wiring possibilities.  

Don't be too quick to jump into some conversion because it is not yet understood.
If you had a generator, I might waver on that - but even at that I'd suggest going to a stock Motorola system because there is zero need for anything else on these cars, among other reasons.....

It's likely simple - but too many are too afraid of these things due to lack of understanding, so tend to jump "because it's easier".
It isn't easier - especially if you already understand charging systems as I do, and have worked with them for over 45 years (yeah, I was a teen when I started - repaired my first Prestolite Rambler wiper motor at 14 and first Motorola system at about 15) and because now you fabricate brackets, modify wiring, change belts and alignments, etc. Simple is fixing it.
It doesn't take even a 40 amp system to keep up with a stock Rambler. (AMC used 40 amp alternators on Ramblers with AC, 35 without..  55 came later.)


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vinny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jun/22/2018 at 3:15am
As I remember it on my Canadian built 64 Classic. Orange #10 or #8 from alternator to A on regulator. Small orange from indicator light attached to big orange from alternator at the regulator.. Across from A on the regulator is B and it is a heavy red #10 or #8 and runs into the harness as previously described. 

If you can get a CS130 mounted there is a connector PLI/FS on it. L would go to the little orange. S would go to big red. Run a new #8 about 2 1/2 feet long from alternator output to the battery plus. Tape up the unused wires.


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