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Harlan Sharp rockers

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PHAT69AMX View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PHAT69AMX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/02/2020 at 6:09pm
Not all rocker studs are created equal, differences in hex size, thickness, and blend radius.
Overall and threaded length varies as well as how the poly locks are threaded, full through, or not.
The HS Rocker Trunion pivot Centerline should be inline at 90 degrees with the
valve stem tip to rocker arm roller face when the valve is at about 1/2 of full open lift.
This can only be sat and adjusted by machining the Rocker Stud Boss height, if needed.
There's actually quite a bit going on and must be paid attention to in this area to get it correct.


Edited by PHAT69AMX - Apr/06/2020 at 9:31pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ramzilla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/03/2020 at 6:59pm
Thanks for all your help.
But I got bad news pulled off driver head number seven combustion chamber had divits in it also piston but cylinder was not damaged valve guide .394 wobble valve.
Yesterday pulled off passenger head four and eight combustion chamber damaged four really bad. Today cleaned pistons still in head. Number four cylinder scratched up.
I quit street racing with it back in 1976 because it was just not running right, I thought it was cam. Now I know why someone removed top of air cleaner put something in there maybe nuts or washers something metal.
I am really bummed out. Also mad because I think I know who did it.
Larry
SC Rambler
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ramzilla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2020 at 8:41pm
Yes I am replying to myself. Went back out today to look over cylinder check out scratches. Determined that scratches three of them deepest is about .008 inch so I quess it is not as bad as I thought.
Hone it and throw in new pistons?
And can I get matching weight rods and pistons without having to balance crank?
If I need to bore cylinders and balance crank I may just do the K1 stroker if I can figure out the right pistons.
When I get a chance I am going to see Dan Curtis to get his input.
Just live a couple of miles from him although I have never been there.
Larry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PROSTOCKTOM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2020 at 9:33pm
Rather than sugar coat it I'll just say this, If you don't really know what your doing find someone that does. When you start mixing and matching around rods and pistons you had better plan on balancing an engine. Myself I have even a stock engine balanced because it really does matter and what's $200 extra for the cost of building an engine? I guess I am a little taken by your comments. You have a 69 SC Rambler and your worried about changing out the rocker studs to make a great set of rockers work, but your talking building a stroker for that car? Your either interested in keeping it as close to original as possible or ruin the value of it by changing out the rotating assembly for more cubes? If I owned an SC Rambler which I would love to own it would never be anything more than the original crank and rods. Piston replacement is common and is something that has to happen for one reason or another. You own a rare piece of AMC history please take care of it.

Tom

Molnar Technologies Full Service Dealer - Crankshafts & Connecting Rods

1969 AMC Rambler Rouge Race Car
1974 AMC Hornet Hatchback, Wally Booth Outlaw Nostalgic Pro Stock Race Car Project
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PHAT69AMX View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PHAT69AMX Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2020 at 9:50pm
Hopefully you can find a good set of stock pistons, even if good used.
But be aware stock cast pistons were prone to detonation breakage and tune accordingly.
For a fair weather 1,500 miles per year hobby car a hone & re-ring would be fine imho.
Stock pistons I would think would prevent a need for re-balance, but balance may be still be needed
if your existing stock rods get new rod bolts and are re-conditioned, made .003 shorter,
But different folks have different priorities, and it is always difficult to avoid mission creep.
What a bummer if someone did sabotage it... Musta spanked'em pretty bad, huh ?
The way my limited experience went, farm out as little as possible, and do as much as possible yourself.
But make an honest realistic plan first, after disassembly and inspection, as you're doing.


Edited by PHAT69AMX - Apr/06/2020 at 11:55pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ramzilla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/06/2020 at 10:49pm
It was a friend of a friend not my friend. He always bugged me about racing his Mustang. I keep telling him no but one day he come over with my friend. We went down to a two lane highway I stayed in it about another 1/4 mile or so turned around in farmers drive an came back toward him at 120 or so. He was still trying to catch me. I did not say a word but my friend did.
Yes he was mad and that is the only person that I know of that would do something like that.
One friend had a 1969 Z 28 another 1969 390 AMX another 1969 340 Duster 1970 Cougler Eliminator 351 Clevand
You name it. Those were the days.
And yes Tom sometimes I talk crazy about my car. I am boxing up every factory part. I think I should have it bored because of that one cylinder. Tom In reality I am considering Molnar or k 1 rods and DSS racing pistons because of them having in stock 4.165 but now I guess I could use Wiseco pistons because I think they have in stock 4.185. Yes I will need to find someone to balance my motor. Also the Heads one exhaust valve bore is .394 all others only .001 worn only 20,000 mile motor. But the number 4 combustion chamber head is beat up. I have an old motor book The Complete Book of Engines No 7 1971 They have Motor builds from every manufacture In that book they do a build on a 343 using a 390 crank They have a picture of the head where they open up the combustion chamber and if I did that it would clean up that bad spot. Then I would need to matched all the others and cc them I could use the heads. Not sure how much that would change 50.6 cc.
But it looks like a lot of work. I am sure you know what I mean. If I knew how to send picture I would.
Appreciate all your input and help.
Larry     
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trader Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/07/2020 at 8:38am
Sorry about the experience, crappy thing for some one to do!

If you weigh all the the components on the way out and can match everything on the way back to go in there is no need to re-balance the rotating assembly.
ARP studs are only 3g heavier then the stock studs (they were not matched themselves!). They can be ground that much off the ends and finished to the same weight.
Wiesco + 0.030" pistons were 30g under but I found wrist pins with heavier wall to add 30g at the small end of the rod (had to machine some of the ID to get the 30g).
I had the factory rods stress relieved and re-tempered, less then half the price of new rods and probably better then when they came from the factory.
It can be done - it's just how much effort you want to put into it or can do yourself.



Edited by Trader - Apr/07/2020 at 8:40am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbwicz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/07/2020 at 9:15am
There are plenty of good people in this hobby that will help guide you to making this right.
Another option, though expensive, is to look at custom pistons. Because of the damage that you have, if you have the heads straightened out, and make all chambers similar cc, then a custom piston will allow you to set whatever quench clearance and compression ratio that you want. That way you can set the car up for pump gas and use it more. Plus, if you only need to go .020 over, then you can keep the block as sturdy as possible.
This is just an option if you decide to go thru the entire engine. Dan Curtis and Alfano performance have custom pistons made for AMC's, I'm sure there are others. But its an option for you for an additional $500 or so compared to shelf pistons.
Ultimately, its awesome that you still have the car after all these years. take your time and plan out the rebuild.

Have fun,
Mike
1970 AMX, one step forward, one step back. Both steps cost time and money.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ramzilla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/07/2020 at 11:25am
Mike
There are plenty of stories about what my car went through. And how I still have it intact after all these years. Will tell my story one of these days. I am so excited to get it together that some time I don't make sence. Glad I have my AMC Buddies to keep me on track.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jmerican Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Apr/07/2020 at 11:44am
Realistically given the history of hard use, and likely sabotage, and the fact that the car has been snoozing all these years, and oh yeah, it’s valuable.... I think you should face the idea that it will need tear down and expert machinist and engine builder eyeballs. Then formulate a plan. You may have bent rods, bad cam bearings, and valvetrain issues beyond the obvious. Right? 

It’s always a cool thought to think... the car lived and is mostly all there. 
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