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T 10 BEARINGS |
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70amxvegas 
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Joined: Apr/26/2009 Location: Lost Wages Status: Offline Points: 1793 |
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 Topic: T 10 BEARINGSPosted: Nov/11/2018 at 6:35pm |
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Now way back in 2004 i had a Javelin that had a fresh t 10 rebuild. I did a big burn out and the trans got stuck in first it, would not budge. I had the t 10 tore apart .The NEW rebuilder said that first gear was welded to the main shaft since it got so hot and even with his press it would not budge it loose .He got all the used parts together but would not assembly it because the bearings from the rebuild kit were not correct .He said he checked all his sources and there should be a almost 30-45% angle from the I.D of the bearing to allow gear oil to travel more freely.I did find a AMC OEM bearing and when i showed it to him he said this is what we need ? Have you heard of incorrect bearings in the rebuild kits SOLD TODAY ?
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bigbadgreen
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Joined: Jan/07/2009 Location: WI Status: Offline Points: 1770 |
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Posted: Nov/11/2018 at 6:50pm |
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Id ask Kirkwood.ive used gearbox.com in the past with success.
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PHAT69AMX
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Joined: Jul/07/2007 Location: West Virginia Status: Offline Points: 5919 |
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Posted: Nov/11/2018 at 10:13pm |
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If someone can give me some bearing part numbers, dimensions, and type, I have an old printed Bearings Interchange Manual and will see what I can find in it. Also, and yes there are others, but S&K Speed in New York, afaik still has a separate Transmission Shop ran by the honorable Brian Higgins, original #19 Hurst S/S AMX Mechanic, who was / is about everything T-10...
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GnipGnop4
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Joined: Jun/04/2013 Location: SoCal Status: Offline Points: 292 |
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Posted: Nov/19/2018 at 11:42am |
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Some good resources in this article... https://www.hotrod.com/articles/t-10-transmission-better-than-new/
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AMXican
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Joined: Oct/09/2018 Location: Denver, CO Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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Posted: Nov/19/2018 at 7:48pm |
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I worried about that while I looked at AMC T-10 rebuild kits. I called Paul Cangialosi after reading his "How to" book. He sells rebuild kits but didn't have a AMC kit in stock but he recommended I call Brian at S-K. Brian told me that the AMC T-10 rear bearing has a chamfer or radius (can't remember) in it and if it didn't the trans wouldn't make it a hundred miles. He didn't tell me this but I think AMC's are different because they were first gen iron case Super T-10s. He did tell me that he got the "special" bearing out of C-4 Corvette BW/Doug Nash overdrive T-10s because the AMC oem bearing was hard to find. His kit also comes with a sealed input bearing from the same.
He gave me tips, tricks and encouragement that made the difference for a successful rebuild with my meager skills - first manual trans rebuild. It works great! S-K Manual Transmissions Brian Higgins (631) 957-9427
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bwamx
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Joined: Mar/27/2012 Location: CT Status: Offline Points: 143 |
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Posted: Nov/23/2018 at 4:45pm |
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Yes Brian at SK is the man.. I've spoken to him in the past, he is a wealth of knowledge.
Here is a link to pics of a AMC T-10 build & what happens to the mid plate bearing IF it makes contact with 1st gear when using a bearing with a large radius on the ID of the bearing like supplied in most rebuild kits. The large radius if to large allows the main shaft to move and the bearing contacts 1st gear. Not my site , found it looking for more info on the bearings long ago. http://www.aaa-ammo.com/t10build.htm The issue is the radius on the ID sleeve of the bearing. Back in the day the ID had a small chamfer, here is a original bearing I had removed from a trans.  Old & New style side by side Note the bearing on the left is a sealed style but has the correct ID. The one on the right is what is normally what is in all the rebuild kits.  The main shaft step & 1st gear.  Now I have run the incorrect bearing with NO problem BUT they have hit the step on the shaft and did NOT contact 1st gear . PRM wise I run my transmissions hard. I launch at 5500 rpm shift @ 7400+ I have and run all of the ratios V, P & T . Bearing numbers Old style Federal 1307GC Federal Mogul BCA 307-L NSK & SKF 6307 Timken 1307 There are correct old stock bearing out there you just have to find them. Also I do not run the bearings sealed , I remove the seals and oil lube them. If left sealed and grease only they are rpm limited to 6000 rpm max. Edited by bwamx - Nov/23/2018 at 7:11pm |
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70amxvegas
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Posted: Nov/23/2018 at 5:42pm |
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Very interesting , the T10 i wanted to rebuild has a frozen first gear and with even a press it will not come loose. So i am scrapping the idea to rebuild it due to cost of finding a main shaft , first and second gear and a hub. But the kit i have which i am returning has that same bearing that you show. I am looking for another 2.23 to rebuild and will find some OEM AMC bearings for the rebuild. .I have a nice 2.64 in the car now ,which i will sale .
Edited by 70amxvegas - Nov/23/2018 at 7:04pm |
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PHAT69AMX
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Joined: Jul/07/2007 Location: West Virginia Status: Offline Points: 5919 |
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Posted: Nov/23/2018 at 6:59pm |
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All this is from an old paper printed Engineering Bearing Interchange Manual: ? Is all this helpful useful Bearing Part Number information ? Starting with as-posted -> Federal # 1307CG = Conrad Type... Ref, Federal Brg Part #1307CG in this interchange book, not "1307GC".. 35 mm / 1.3780" = Bore 80 mm / 3.1496" = O.D. 21 mm / 0.8268" = Width ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series with Snap Ring: note: ? "NR" in many part numbers, ? means "No Snap Ring"... maybe ?... ... even though this "general description" says "With Snap Ring" ? 307-L = BCA CONRAD TYPE 1307-L = BCA MAXI TYPE 307KG = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 307WG = FAFNIR MAXI TYPE 6307.NR = FAG CONRAD TYPE 307.NR = FAG MAXI TYPE 1307CG = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE 1307MG = FEDERAL MAXI TYPE 307-G = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307NR = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # M-307-G = HOOVER-NSK MAXI TYPE 307-SG = MRC CONRAD TYPE 307-MG = MRC MAXI TYPE 43307 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 41307 = NDH MAXI TYPE 6307NR = NTN CONRAD TYPE BL307NR = NTN MAXI TYPE 6307NR = SKF CONRAD TYPE 307NR = SKF MAXI TYPE ----- In this section Book shows No Shields, Seals, or Snap Ring Groove... Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series: 307 = BCA CONRAD TYPE 1307 = BCA MAXI TYPE 307K = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 307W = FAFNIR MAXI TYPE 1307 = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE 1307M = FEDERAL MAXI TYPE 6307 = NTN CONRAD TYPE BL307 = NTN MAXI TYPE 6307 = GENERAL CONRAD TYPE 307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # M-307 = HOOVER-NSK MAXI TYPE Notch 307-S = MRC CONRAD TYPE 307-R = MRC MAXI TYPE 307-M = MRC MAXI TYPE Notch 3307 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 1307 = NDH MAXI TYPE 6307 = SKF CONRAD TYPE 6307/C78 = SKF CONRAD TYPE ABEC5 307 = SKF MAXI TYPE ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series Contact Seal One Side: 307-C = BCA CONRAD TYPE 307NP = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 6307.RS = FAG CONRAD TYPE 1307L = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE BUNA N LIP SEAL 1307R = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE BUNA N SEAL 6307-RS = GENERAL CONRAD TYPE 9307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307DU = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # 307-SZ = MRC CONRAD TYPE ABEC 5 or 7 AVAILABLE Z9607 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 6307LB = NTN CONRAD TYPE SINGLE LIP SEAL 6307LU = NTN CONRAD TYPE DOUBLE LIP SEAL 6307 RS = SKF CONRAD TYPE ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series Contact Seal Both Sides: 307-CC = BCA CONRAD TYPE 307NPP = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 6307.2RS = FAG CONRAD TYPE 1307LL = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE BUNA N LIP SEALS 1307RR = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE BUNA N SEALS 6307-2RS = GENERAL CONRAD TYPE 99307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307DDU = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # 307-SZZ = MRC CONRAD TYPE Z99607 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 6307LLB = NTN CONRAD TYPE SINGLE LIP SEALS 6307LLU = NTN CONRAD TYPE DOUBLE LIP SEALS 6307 2RS = SKF CONRAD TYPE ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series Shield One Side: 307-S = BCA CONRAD TYPE 1307-S = BCA MAXI TYPE 307KD = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 307WD = FAFNIR MAXI TYPE 6307.Z = FAG CONRAD TYPE 307.Z = FAG MAXI TYPE 1307F = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE 1307MF = FEDERAL MAXI TYPE 6307-Z = GENERAL CONRAD TYPE 7307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307Z = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # M-7307 = HOOVER-NSK MAXI TYPE 307-SF = MRC CONRAD TYPE 307-MF = MRC MAXI TYPE 7607 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 7307 = NDH MAXI TYPE 6307Z = NTN CONRAD TYPE BL307Z = NTN MAXI TYPE 6307Z = SKF CONRAD TYPE 307Z = SKF MAXI TYPE ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series Shield One Side w/ Snap Ring: 307-SL = BCA CONRAD TYPE 1307-SL = BCA MAXI TYPE 307KDG = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 307WDG = FAFNIR MAXI TYPE 6307.ZNR = FAG CONRAD TYPE 307.ZNR = FAG MAXI TYPE 1307MGF = FEDERAL MAXI TYPE 7307-G = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307ZNR = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # M-7307-G = HOOVER-NSK MAXI TYPE 307-SFG = MRC CONRAD TYPE 307-MFG = MRC MAXI TYPE 47607 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 47307 = NDH MAXI TYPE 6307ZNR = NTN CONRAD TYPE BL307ZNR = NTN MAXI TYPE 6307ZNR = SKF CONRAD TYPE 307ZNR = SKF MAXI TYPE ----- Single Row Radial Metric Medium (300) Series Shield Both Sides: 307-SS = BCA CONRAD TYPE 1307-SS = BCA MAXI TYPE 307KDD = FAFNIR CONRAD TYPE 307WDD = FAFNIR MAXI TYPE 6307.2Z = FAG CONRAD TYPE 307.2Z = FAG MAXI TYPE 1307FF = FEDERAL CONRAD TYPE 1307MFF = FEDERAL MAXI TYPE 6307-ZZ = GENERAL CONRAD TYPE 77307 = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE Old # 6307ZZ = HOOVER-NSK CONRAD TYPE New # 307-SFF = MRC CONRAD TYPE 307-MFF = MRC MAXI TYPE 77607 = NDH CONRAD TYPE 77307 = NDH MAXI TYPE 6307ZZ = NTN CONRAD TYPE BL307ZZ = NTN MAXI TYPE 63072Z = SKF CONRAD TYPE 3072Z = SKF MAXI TYPE -----
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AMXican
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Joined: Oct/09/2018 Location: Denver, CO Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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Posted: Nov/23/2018 at 7:33pm |
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Thanks bwamx,
That makes sense now. If the i.d. radius on the bearing allows it to move over that shoulder on the main shaft and maybe the gear is a little wide or the assembly tolerance is on the plus side, the bearing i.d. race will rub on the 1st gear. 1st gear spins more than twice the speed of the main shaft in 4th gear. The pics from the link you posted show damage from serious heat. Friction weld!
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bwamx
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Joined: Mar/27/2012 Location: CT Status: Offline Points: 143 |
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Posted: Nov/23/2018 at 7:37pm |
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Just remember you only need to run the bearing with the small chamfer or radius at the mid plate .
The input shaft bearing can be one of the new style it does not matter. Bob
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