Look what followed me home -- 61 American convert!

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   Got to do a little more work on my car, finally!! 

I picked up a set of 99 Honda Accord front and rear 
calipers and rotors at Pull-A-Part last week (March 16). The rear calipers are 
going to be fine, but the front ones maybe not. The hat part is actually
 a little smaller than the Previa rotors Scarebird used (5.98" on Honda 
6.18" on Previa). It still uses the same bolt pattern, so I might turn 
the Rambler hub down. Not worried about the outside edge not having enough "meat" -- Honda uses same bolt pattern, but screw in studs instead of pressed in. 

I'm going to do some measuring first. The Honda 
front rotor is only 1.86" deep (rear edge of rotor to top of hat). It's 
11'1" in diameter. Jeep XJ Cherokee 4x4 rotors are 11" and 3.07" deep, 
Ranger 4x4 rotors are 11.25" and 2.60" deep. Will see which would be a 
better fit for the offset -- probably the Ranger.

I've got an early 
Scarebird kit that uses the Ranger rotor and some spacer rings for the 
seals -- I may just use that on the front. I haven't checked the rotor 
fit on the rear axle yet, but the hat is bigger in diameter on the rears
 -- the front hub will JUST fit in the rear rotor. Too bad it's solid 
and smaller diameter! If I got with the Scarebird front kit I may just use GM calipers as well. 

I kind of lucked out on the Accord parts. came off a 99 Accord, but it apparently had a brake job recently. All rotors and pads are in great condition, just some surface rust. Not pits or gouges in rotors, very little wear. Hate to not use them after paying $186 for everything! Well, it's worth that if I only use the rear calipers and park brake cables though. Can simply use the Honda balancer on the end of the Rambler American park brake cable where the original cable balancer went. Just have to make a mount for the cable ends, which might simply bolt to the floor. In photo below both cables have an end with bolt hole, left just has the rubber boot covering (Honda cables went through floor then bolted down -- I have boots on both but won't need them). The cable ends fit in the balancer. Might have to ream hole in center of balancer for the Rambler pull cable. These cables and balancer are one reason I decided to try mounting the Honda rear calipers. Just figured I'd get the fronts while there and see if they fit since bolt pattern is correct...

Edited by farna - Mar/20/2023 at 11:41am

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farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/20/2023 at 11:21am
	Got to do a little more work on my car, finally!! I picked up a set of 99 Honda Accord front and rear calipers and rotors at Pull-A-Part last week (March 16). The rear calipers are going to be fine, but the front ones maybe not. The hat part is actually a little smaller than the Previa rotors Scarebird used (5.98" on Honda 6.18" on Previa). It still uses the same bolt pattern, so I might turn the Rambler hub down. Not worried about the outside edge not having enough "meat" -- Honda uses same bolt pattern, but screw in studs instead of pressed in. I'm going to do some measuring first. The Honda front rotor is only 1.86" deep (rear edge of rotor to top of hat). It's 11'1" in diameter. Jeep XJ Cherokee 4x4 rotors are 11" and 3.07" deep, Ranger 4x4 rotors are 11.25" and 2.60" deep. Will see which would be a better fit for the offset -- probably the Ranger. I've got an early Scarebird kit that uses the Ranger rotor and some spacer rings for the seals -- I may just use that on the front. I haven't checked the rotor fit on the rear axle yet, but the hat is bigger in diameter on the rears -- the front hub will JUST fit in the rear rotor. Too bad it's solid and smaller diameter! If I got with the Scarebird front kit I may just use GM calipers as well. I kind of lucked out on the Accord parts. came off a 99 Accord, but it apparently had a brake job recently. All rotors and pads are in great condition, just some surface rust. Not pits or gouges in rotors, very little wear. Hate to not use them after paying $186 for everything! Well, it's worth that if I only use the rear calipers and park brake cables though. Can simply use the Honda balancer on the end of the Rambler American park brake cable where the original cable balancer went. Just have to make a mount for the cable ends, which might simply bolt to the floor. In photo below both cables have an end with bolt hole, left just has the rubber boot covering (Honda cables went through floor then bolted down -- I have boots on both but won't need them). The cable ends fit in the balancer. Might have to ream hole in center of balancer for the Rambler pull cable. These cables and balancer are one reason I decided to try mounting the Honda rear calipers. Just figured I'd get the fronts while there and see if they fit since bolt pattern is correct... Edited by farna - Mar/20/2023 at 11:41am
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/20/2023 at 11:24am
	This last Saturday (March 18) I took the front suspension apart. Not good! The Type 2 steering knuckle and trunnion are worn inside. Type 2 has a pass through lower trunnion with a washer/castle nut/ cotter pin on the bottom instead of screwing into the trunnion and the threads holding it on. The knuckle looks like it had threads... don't think the trunnion did, but might have. The threads are worn down and the knuckle pin easily slides in and out of the trunnion, with a little wiggle room. Going to check my parts stash and see if I have a good steering knuckle (Type 1). I know I have a good trunnion... somewhere... If I don't have one I'll either find another Type 1 knuckle and trunnion or have an insert put in the Type 2 trunnion to tighten things up. Will probably use a steel sleeve since it's greased, but could use bronze. I've got one bad lower arm and one bad upper. Both upper trunnions and pins are good, pins came right out! That's a first for me -- all my other cars have been high mileage with stuck pins. This one only has 43,219 miles -- and no signs that it could be 143,219. The lower arm is worn on the end where the cap nut (officially "bushing") had just started turning. The pressed in lip is thin but not worn away. I might just peen it in then tack weld the bushing in three or more places. I'm going to put a single tack on all the bushings to make sure they don't turn. Other than that wear is acceptable, though the vertical pin in the Type 1 trunnion had dry rust in it, no grease! I think someone took it apart, cleaned, then put back together without grease, probably thinking they'd grease it later. Edited by farna - Mar/20/2023 at 11:30am
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/21/2023 at 5:38am
	Got to do a little more work Monday! Spent most of the morning sorting and naming photos from previous work, and making the previous two posts. Then I went over to my shop for a couple hours and got 90% of the welding done for the front sill repairs just above the lower front suspension mounts. This is the right side damage, with a sheet metal "cover" welded over it when I got the car. Really just hides the damaged area, not what I'd consider a "repair". Here is the area with the cover removed and cleaned up. Pretty big hole! There are two layers of 18 gauge sheet metal missing, the inner and outer fender panels overlap here and are welded to the sill. I have the patch panel cut from what I think is 14 gauge steel here, about the thickness of the two 18 gauge panels. You can see that the outer side lines up well with the existing outer side panel. Here is the welded in patch, after grinding. you would hardly think I used to be a welding instructor! I'm using a little Campbell-Hausfeld 110V short circuit MIG welder, with Argon/CO2 mix gas. It's hard to get a good weld with this thing! It welds ok on clean metal, but rusty metal is tough, especially rusty and THIN metal! If I had much more welding to do I'd go buy a better one, or borrow my brother's 220V MIG (can't recall brand, but it's one of the well known ones...). He just has flux core wire and generally welds thicker material. I was thinking the lower voltage machine wouldn't burn through as much. Filling those two big gaps was hard!! Luckily the car is well undercoated, so after putting some primer on the patch I'm going to spray a bit more undercoating over this, which will hide the "snotty" welds!! I used to tell my students it was a poor welder who blamed his equipment, but we had industrial Miller Synchrowave machines. I was tempted to quit and go buy a welder about half way through, but then realized I'd not be doing that much welding after this... and my brother has one that I could get wire for and use my gas bottle. Didn't want to stop even though progress was slow with all the required grinding... I got most of the welding done on the other side before the machine got too hot and quit. You can only weld about 15-20 minutes out of an hour with this type machine. I'd been going for about an hour and a half, welding 2-5 minutes, grinding 5-10, then welding some more. Right near the end it started spitting and popping a bit more, then shut down. It would be at least a half hour before I could do any decent welding again, so I left the left side about 90% welded. Still need to do a little filling in some gaps then grind back down. Top photo below is area ready for repair, bottom is 90% repair. You can see that I got this patch panel a lot closer fitting so there would be no large gaps to fill. Looking at the photo, I may be finished with this one, not the 90% I thought when I quit yesterday. May be able to see a few skipped spots in person though. Practice helps -- you can tell I did a lot better on this one! Welded less before grinding, for one thing, didn't have any large gaps to fill for another. A good fitting patch is crucial with one of these little welders!! I have to say that the photos don't make the job look as bad as in person... Edited by farna - Mar/21/2023 at 6:11am
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Mar/21/2023 at 6:12am
	In case anyone is interested in the time and money I have in it so far, here is my build log. Only 14.5 hours and $241.79 in it after purchase and pick-up so far! Lots more to do, and I'm not including material cost for things I have on hand, like the patch pieces and welding material. 1961 Rambler American Convertible Restomod Expense Log Serial # B304395 --- 2022 --- 26 Nov 2022 – $3000.00 -- Purchased from Charles Frank, 9356 Horseshoe Circle, Indian Land, SC 29707 Phone (704) 806-1209 26 Nov 2022 – $53.00, 5 hrs -- Gas for ~230 mile round trip to pick up car. --- 2023 --- 12 Jan – 2 hrs – Put car up on jackstands 20 Jan – 3 hrs – Remove front suspension and move parts from inside of car, retract top frame 28 Jan – 2 hrs – Start rust repair at lower front suspension mounts (remove old covers, clean up) 16 Mar – $186.79, 3 hrs -- Purchased front and rear 1999 Honda Accord disc brakes from Pull-A-Part 18 Mar – $15, 2 hrs – Disassembled front suspension, cleaned Honda brakes - $15 for spray paint 20 Mar – 2.5 hrs – Welded repair patches in for lower front suspension mounts Edited by farna - Mar/21/2023 at 6:16am
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/04/2023 at 7:46pm
	Haven't done a lot in the past couple months! 30 May - 2.5 hrs - Removed left front suspension assembly from parts car, disassembled and cleaned up 30 May - 0.5 hrs - $157.28 - Purchased new lower trunnion (TRW 10154) from E-bay seller "Mechanical Innovation Factory" I also found that the reason my welder wasn't doing so good wasn't due to overheating but the gas running out! Got that fixed. Won't be adding that to the cost list as it's general shop supplies and I won't be using much. My last bottle lasted five years!! I also found out that the Honda rotors won't fit over the drum hubs (with drums removed, of course). Like the Scarebird kit that uses Toyota Previa rotors, the hubs need about 1/16" (about 1/8" of diameter) removed from the outer edge for the Honda rotor to fit. I also have a set of 2003 Ranger rotors in the shop from my old ranger Sport 2WD. They fit over the hub and are deeper -- I'll measure things and see which one fits best before I turn the hubs down. Edited by farna - Jun/04/2023 at 7:56pm
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jun/04/2023 at 8:16pm
	Here are pics of the parts car and front suspension. You will note that the lower trunnion was buried in the dirt -- had been for the last 20 years! believe it or not it wasn't rusted together -- I suspected it might be. The lower trunnion is a little loose in the side caps, but once greased I think it would be usable. It's not so loose as to pull put of the threads by a long shot, just enough to wiggle with no grease at all. Since I could find an NORS replacement I won't be using the loose one though! Don't really want to do it again. The lower arms have some pitting but are both in otherwise good shape, and not pitted enough to be an issue. The ends of the arms where the caps screw in have no wear! I'll just be using one of them, keeping the other as a spare. Amazingly the upper trunnion cross bolt/pin screwed right out with no trouble at all! I expected it to be seized as well. I sprayed it good with penetrating oil and let it sit for a couple minutes, then put the upper trunnion in a vice and gingerly pulled on the bolt head with my pull handle. It was a little stiff, but not seized! I turned it a couple turns out, one back in, and repeated this 3-4 times, then turned it all the way out. Threaded pin is in great shape with no discernible wear, as are the holes in the upper arms. First photo is of the parts car where it's sat at the edge of the woods on my brother's farm for the last 20 years. I had just taken the bolt out holding the suspension in when I thought to take some pics. You can see why I was surprised the lower trunnions weren't just one big rusted together mass! The bottom photo shows all the parts disassembled. My nephew was sand blasting some truck parts at my brother's shop right next to mine so I had him hit the lower arms. I'll be cleaning up and painting the rest sometime this month! Edited by farna - Jun/04/2023 at 8:18pm
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jul/09/2023 at 6:19pm
	Finally found a couple hours to do some more work! So add this to the list: 09 July - 2.0 hrs - Removed sleeves and rubber from all front control arms, cleaned and painted. Will use soft polyurethane inserts in original housings per Tom Jennings (https://www.ramblerlore.com/AMC/Suspension-1950-1963-small-highperf/index.html#POLY) Everything cleaned up nicely! I did find one upper control arm with a bit of wear where the pin goes through. Picked out the best of three (I had a spare set of upper arms) and will use it. That makes a total of 24.5 hours invested so far, and $3412.07. Yeah, all sounds good, but I really haven't done much yet... Edited by farna - Jul/09/2023 at 6:27pm
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jul/10/2023 at 9:03am
	Photos of control arms and removing rubber from the bushings. I used Tom's method of removing the rubber. I drilled 8-10 1/8" holes in the rubber around the circumference of the sleeve then pushed the sleeve out. I found that a 15mm deep well socket fit the sleeve perfectly to drive it out. The rubber came out easily by prying loose with a screwdriver once the sleeve was removed. Don't forget to save the sleeves! I then spent about an hour and a half researching a replacement for the Ridetech 90001596, which doesn't seem to be available. I think I've found one, but have an inquiry in to another company that may have a softer version (closer to rubber). Will see what they have to say and report back! I added that 1.5 hours to my total time -- 26 hours so far. I'm not adding the time it's taking to document here on the Forum, but the extra time to pause and take photos is in the time I'm working. Didn't take a photo of the painted arms, will get that later when I actually put bushings in. The silvery looking arm was sand blasted due to being in the mud for 2-3 decades on the small end. Some pitting, but not enough to compromise strength. The others I just wire brushed and painted.
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jul/13/2023 at 6:21pm
	After spending the time to remove the rubber from the old bushings and ordering spacers ($40.41), I decided against using poly bushings. So I ordered new rubber bushings from AMC Acres (formerly Galvin's). American Parts depot had them listed for $20 each, AMC Acres $49 a pair. I've met the AMC Acres guys and I'm just glad someone bought Galvin's out, just decided to support them since they have more of the older Rambler parts. So to add to my tally: 10 July – 1.5 hrs – Researching poly bushings – Ridetech 90001596 not available (as used by Tom). Energy Suspension bulk-2006 seems to be a good substitute ($22.75 each, would need 8, $182 + tax & shipping) 10 July – 1.0 hrs – $40.41 -- researched and purchased spacers for poly bushings – (irontime-sales.com) 12 July – 1.0 hrs -- $215.47 – decided not to use polyurethane bushings and ordered stock type rubber replacement bushings from AMC Acres (cost is total -- tax and shipping included) 28 hours $3667.95 (as of 13 July 23) So wasted $40.41 and 2.5 hours researching poly bushings, ordering spacers, then deciding against poly! Maybe I'll find a use for the spacers... It's not going to be the only wasted time I'm sure!! Edited by farna - Jul/13/2023 at 6:23pm
	Frank Swygert

farna Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Supporter of TheAMCForum Moderator Lost Dealership Project Joined: Jul/08/2007 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 19676	Post Options Post Reply Quote farna Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: Jul/24/2023 at 8:19pm
	Not much done, but I'll soon have all the parts to put the control arms back together. Once I get that done I'll work on the springs. Still thinking I'm going with air springs in front. Have this to add to the time/cost list: 24 July – 0.5 hrs -- $29.94 – ordered 5/8” ID grommets and O-rings. To be used as new seals for trunnions. Not sure if the 3/16” thick O-rings or the 5/16” grommets will be best. Two O-rings stacked are typically used, but I’m thinking the thicker rubber grommets will work better since they are flat on each side instead of round and may only need one per side instead of two. 28.5 hours $3697.89 (as of 24 July 2023)
	Frank Swygert